marcy
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Post by marcy on Aug 30, 2009 20:51:45 GMT -5
I completely agree Ilwo. He's too good for tv but it's a trade off. Having his greatness interrupted by other "ok" actors' storylines, or commercial breaks is annoying, but we get to see him every week. I'd prefer that he do more amazing film work but then we'd see him twice a year at best. Yes, 16 Years is a brilliant performance worthy of your visceral reaction which we all experienced when seeing the film. I hope he does more like it. The Coen brothers idea is a brilliant one. Unlike most actors who can make you feel, Kevin can also make you laugh hysterically. He has amazing comedic timing and would do fantastically in a Coen brothers production. Keep us posted on your letter-writing efforts to get the Coen brothers up to speed on the wonder that is Kevin.
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Post by ilwo on Sept 2, 2009 16:11:56 GMT -5
Keep us posted on your letter-writing efforts to get the Coen brothers up to speed on the wonder that is Kevin. Sadely, Marcy, I 'm not optimistic about my chances to convince them... So...it was just a dream ...
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Post by Leanne on Dec 1, 2009 8:03:17 GMT -5
This is a sad, fantastic yet uncomfortable movie to watch..
Frankie a lonely child who idolized his father and the relationship his parents have. Has his hopes dashed when he watches his father fall from grace. A situation which is to ruin his life forever, his trust in love and the opposite sex, his search for anger and to be violent which makes him feel in control.
I found the movie sad because here is a guy who tries to come right but his past just keeps eating away at his future. Relationship after relationship fails because of his trust issues. His past friends who will never let him forget.
Frankie is not a bad man he is just a hopeless man a man without hope or direction who finally gives up on life...
some interesting parallels : Frankie standing up on the moment talking of Gods and speaking to citizens ~ reminiscent of Vorenus and possible link to Gods like Poseidon
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Geniusmentis
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Post by Geniusmentis on Dec 1, 2009 9:34:35 GMT -5
Leanne, I like and agree all your review!
I have to add he WAS a man without hope, but every time he is with a woman he starts again to have hope. This is a story about hope and desire. The delusions and disappointments following love (since his childhood, talking about his parents, until his girlfriends) make him believe that maybe there's no hope to change, but every time he changes his mind, because he wants to change. Even at the end he was losing again hope but then he changes his mind and starts again to hope that a change is possible, but his ex-friends are enviuos and violent....
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Post by MarryMeOwen on Dec 1, 2009 10:08:33 GMT -5
I always liked how he used photography in this movie.
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Post by Leanne on Dec 1, 2009 10:26:11 GMT -5
Leanne, I like and agree all your review! I have to add he WAS a man without hope, but every time he is with a woman he starts again to have hope. This is a story about hope and desire. The delusions and disappointments following love (since his childhood, talking about his parents, until his girlfriends) make him believe that maybe there's no hope to change, but every time he changes his mind, because he wants to change. Even at the end he was losing again hope but then he changes his mind and starts again to hope that a change is possible, but his ex-friends are enviuos and violent.... totally agree he does get hope and improve with each relationship, but he is his own worst enemy which will always be his downfall ~ if he had moved away from his home he might have eliminated the friends from the past situation but his non trust in relationships would always destroy his path to save his own life from self destruction Marryme the photography and the voice overs were an intricate part of the movie and character, loved it and totally agree
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Post by MarryMeOwen on Dec 1, 2009 11:22:31 GMT -5
Its one of my favorite storytelling modes in the film, it really helps you connect with and study the character more
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betinad
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Post by betinad on Dec 1, 2009 12:45:20 GMT -5
This is my favorite Kevin movie (or more than that, one of my favorite movies... period) . Obviously, the acting level that Kevin exposes in this movie is breathtaking. Not only how he changes his appearance - not only to show time change, but emotions change - but how he can express emotions and feelings just with his eyes. My favorite part of the movie is his monologue during the aa meeting. "this is where the world spins in the wrong direction, this is where it ends. The realization that everything that you ever wanted will never happen. Gone, gone like the wind, gone forever. 16 f... years of nothing gone". (it is amazing that I watched this movie for the first time years ago and I can remember those lines... and some days I cannot even remember my name ! ) I can't help but cry every time I watch that part. The sadness in his eyes get me every time. And that is what I am thinking when the movie ends. It is to me that Frankie at that time is faced again with that realization : everything that you ever wanted will never happen. No more hope. He is broken in every sense. And what to say about the voice over? I can listen to it all day long ...
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Geniusmentis
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Post by Geniusmentis on Dec 1, 2009 13:09:13 GMT -5
The voiceover (but I should say the voiceovers) along all the movie is maybe the thing that makes me love so much this movie more than all the other things. I remember and recite the 2 first voiceovers, but I'd like to learn by heart all the voiceovers in this movie. I hope to find the script, because I need to see them written.
Yes, Leanne, it's true that his non trust in relationships has always destroyed his path to save his own life from self destruction, but I can say that this is true most of all for the relationship with Mary. He destroys everything without explaining his reasons. But he is at the same time weak and strong (and this is what I love in Frankie). At the end he changes his mind suddenly, so he decides to face his fears. I see hope and the desire of a new and normal life are winning!
In the first relationship I don't give any fault to Frankie. His girlfriend knew him and she didn't have enough patience. At the first difficulty she left him. After all, he managed to control himself, thanking to her, so it didn't happened anything so terrible. He deserved another chance to become stronger.
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Post by milena on Dec 1, 2009 13:27:58 GMT -5
I read quite a lot of critical reviews of this movie and I noticed that while the film as a whole seemed to divide critics, Kevin's performance got only raves. I have to say I agree with this approach. The movie - writing, directing, storytelling - was far from perfect IMO. It just seemed too self-important, overly serious in general tone and too artsy for mere sake of being artsy. But acting was spectacular, particulary from Kevin. Others already mentioned aa meeting and his long monolugue. His eyes, voice, facial expression - it was an overwhelming flood of pure emotions. I've seen this scene many times and always discover something new. The look of pure horror in his eyes when he delivers "The past was there, in front of me" speaks volumes about the way he perceives his "before". And his voice? One of the critics described it as "lyrical" and I think it fits him perfectly. It's a shame he doesn't have more opportunities to speak with his natural accent on screen.
Some of my favourite scenes take place toward the very end - before and after Mary's "betrayal". Franky is not saying much at all in those closing moments but subtlety of Kevin's facial and eye expression is breathtaking. I love the moment when he tells of the guy who tries to "woo" Mary in the bar. He is not even rising his voice, but something about his pose, the way he looks at the guy, is so threatening.
I also loved both female actresses. I've been fond of Laura Fraser since I saw her as Lavinia in "Titus". If 'Rome' writers had included Portia (Brutus's wife) she would have been a perfect choice IMO.
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marcy
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Post by marcy on Dec 1, 2009 22:05:48 GMT -5
I'm so glad we chose 16 Years of Alcohol to start our Movie of the Week because it's one of my most favorite films. There's so much going on here that it's hard to cover it all. The greatest thing about this film is its universality. It's not so much about an alcoholic as it is about someone who comes from a dysfunctional family whose future is set, and haunted, by that dysfunction. It's something we can all relate to on some level.
Kevin's performance is, of course, remarkable, stellar, and a myriad of other glowing adjectives. He brings a humanity to Frankie that is key to embracing and understanding this film. It's Kevin who makes it both compelling and yet difficult to watch. Because of Kevin's portrayal we care about Frankie and want him to succeed. We see through Kevin that Frankie is a victim of his childhood who, like all of us, struggles to put his past where it belongs. We know Frankie, we hurt along with Frankie.
It was a difficult journey to watch as Frankie struggles to conquer his past. The themes of time passing, and hope being constantly redefined based on circumstances, resonate throughout the film taking us up and down with Frankie.
I found it so sad that he kept trying to find hope in others and that he sought it in the wrong people. Helen was from another world and couldn't relate to him or understand him. He saw Helen as a step up in the world rather than just another someone with her own baggage. Mary, also dealing with alcoholism, understood Frankie but was equally grasping for a new life and, thus, was unable to provide the strength he needed to escape his past. Helen represented what Frankie thought his "Idyllic" childhood was before drink, and Mary represented his present. Frankie could find no one who could mirror his future for him.
As some of you have previously mentioned, the AA scene was brilliant in its emotional storytelling. One thing I noticed in the beginning of Frankie's soliloquy is that he never admits to being an alcoholic. Rather he says he's a violent man. I think that's so telling. He's not fueled by alcohol but by anger. His bottled anger about a lost childhood, and lack of guidance and nurturing are what's destroying Frankie not alcohol.
Because Frankie doesn't deal with his demons, which he quells with drink and women, I doubt he'd ever stop drinking. He promised Helen, and showed hope of being sober to Mary. Frankie's promises were as empty as his fathers "promises". At some point he'd become angry again and the process would begin anew.
As for Frankie trying to change and become someone he'd emulate in his full-length mirror he gave it a valiant effort. In the art gallery he was right to put the old couple in their place. He was right, they were rude as he was only trying to learn. And Frankie had a valid question when asking the couple why something subjective like art is good. It seemed to me to symbolize Frankie himself asking to be called good and not understanding why he wasn't. Of course, we think he didn't have to threaten the couple so gruesomely, or did he? He tells them "in my world..." and he's right, in his world that's how it's done. He's been shown no other frame of reference. Again, he is a victim of his childhood. Of course, as adults, we can't hang on to a dysfunctional childhood as an excuse for everything, but in Frankie's case I think it's true. He had no lifeline, no one to teach him a different way. This was such a tragic story of a life lost from the beginning.
Kevin was incredible in this film and gave it the heart it needed to be seen as the heartbreak it was.
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Post by MarryMeOwen on Dec 1, 2009 22:49:45 GMT -5
I'm going to plagarize what I wrote for the scrapbook project and my blog for 16 Years 16 Years of Alcohol (2003) I think my favorite character study that Kevin McKidd has performed in was as “Frankie” in 16 Years of Alcohol a film by Scottish director Richard Jobson. Frankie is a young Scottish man whose life has been wasted so to speak, as a child of an alcoholic, we see how Frankie is desperate to not become the person he loathes most, his father. It’s easy to take a first glance and say it’s a rip off of Kubrick’s A Clockwork Orange, but while the film references Clockwork (there is a poster in Frankie’s room) it is far from a re-telling of that film. If anything, I think Frankie is the anti-Alex because he realizes his failures even though it may be too late. I also love the theatrical quality of this film, you can tell from how some of the shots are composed and just the way the script flows, theatre has been a big influence on the look of the film as well as still photography. I would say that this is one of the best works to see Kevin McKidd stand alone in a dramatic role.
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Post by Leanne on Dec 2, 2009 2:42:36 GMT -5
Milena I actually dont do arty movies, they are just not something I enjoy but I was captured by 16yrs and I think for the very reasons you mention its one of Kevin's movies which just highlights all his little nuances and delicate ways he shows us the audience whats going on in his mind... he was truly brilliant in the movie
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Geniusmentis
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Post by Geniusmentis on Dec 2, 2009 11:03:04 GMT -5
Maybe this is the only arty film I like, but I think that this is perfect, maybe because Kevin is perfect!
It is to notice that even Frankie's father has become an alcoholic!!
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marcy
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Post by marcy on Dec 3, 2009 5:48:39 GMT -5
Two things I've always wondered about this film, and maybe you guys can help me, are:
When Frankie helps that drunk in the street who catches the bus, is that his dad or is Frankie just seeing his father's face representing all drunks?
It's confusing when Frankie really knew Mary. She's sitting alone at the bar and he walks up to her, BUT that's after the AA scene.
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Post by dutchie on Dec 3, 2009 8:01:11 GMT -5
I re-watched 16 years last night (didn't plan to, but went to check the quality of the download en couldn't bring myself to stop watching ;D ) and actually wondered the same thing, about Mary. We see the AA-meeting first, but then we see them in the bar meeting for the first time. And during the AA-meeting he tells about having joined acting classes, which sounded to me as if that too already had taken place. So I'm a also bit confused here...
About the drunk in the street... I think it actually was his father.
I'm not a review-writer so I am not even going to try. I just wanted to say that I really loved this movie. I loved the voice overs. There are some thruths about life being said, that really touched me. Made me think about myself and life in general. The photograps work really well too, as a kind of synopsis of happier times, without elaborately going into those events. I think Kevin's acting is excellent in this movie (again). You can really see the change in his person during the course of the movie. He changes from the tough/violent/otherwise emotionless skinhead he first was, to a softer, more caring person when he meets Helen. But you can also see he'll never fully be able to let go of his past. You can see when a fuse blows and any moment he will relapse into his old behaviour. You can actually feel the pain. I really love this movie, although it left me really sad again. But maybe that's a sign the movie really IS good. Wouldn't touch me on that level otherwise.
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Geniusmentis
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Post by Geniusmentis on Dec 3, 2009 9:14:45 GMT -5
We see the AA-meeting first, but then we see them in the bar meeting for the first time. And during the AA-meeting he tells about having joined acting classes, which sounded to me as if that too already had taken place. So I'm a also bit confused here... About the drunk in the street... I think it actually was his father. It's because we see him recalling/remembering their first meeting. Yes, the drunk, beaten by the boys and saved my Frankie, is his father. An interesting review. www.duneidyn.com/film-reviews
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Post by Leanne on Dec 3, 2009 10:29:10 GMT -5
Two things I've always wondered about this film, and maybe you guys can help me, are: When Frankie helps that drunk in the street who catches the bus, is that his dad or is Frankie just seeing his father's face representing all drunks? It's confusing when Frankie really knew Mary. She's sitting alone at the bar and he walks up to her, BUT that's after the AA scene. One of the reasons Im never so thrilled with arty movies is that they dont film in a conventional way which can make them hard to follow and much is not explained but left to the audience to figure out.... So yes we are dealing with flash backs in that Bar scene he starts at the AA meeting and then goes on to tell there story..
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Post by kaz on Dec 4, 2009 5:52:27 GMT -5
The thing that I find the most intriguing about this movie is that although it deals with a very ugly side of domestic life, it does it in such a beautiful way. Even from the start, as I am watching Frankie get beaten and I realise that this is going to end badly, that it is unlikely to turn out the way I had hoped (with Frankie surviving), I can't help but marvel at the sheer breathtaking quality of it all.
Everything about it is stunning - those voiceovers, the way the movie is shot, the use of music and rhythm and just sound in general (or lack thereof).
This is the sort of movie that will always stay on my list of favourites.
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Geniusmentis
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Post by Geniusmentis on Dec 4, 2009 9:54:21 GMT -5
The thing that I find the most intriguing about this movie is that although it deals with a very ugly side of domestic life, it does it in such a beautiful way. Even from the start, as I am watching Frankie get beaten and I realise that this is going to end badly, that it is unlikely to turn out the way I had hoped (with Frankie surviving), I can't help but marvel at the sheer breathtaking quality of it all. Everything about it is stunning - those voiceovers, the way the movie is shot, the use of music and rhythm and just sound in general (or lack thereof). This is the sort of movie that will always stay on my list of favourites. I agree all!!!
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